Wednesdays With Watson: Faith & Trauma Amy Watson- PTSD Patient-Trauma Survivor

The Power of Honest Conversations & Community

• Amy Watson: Trauma Survivor, Hope Carrier, Precious Daughter Of The Most High God • Season 6 • Episode 21

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This is Pt 2 of my conversation with Crissy as we step back into the early days of PTSD diagnosis. Pt 1: on Apple Podcast or Here

Ever wondered how to navigate the complexities of PTSD and domestic violence? Join us in this special summer hiatus of the Wednesdays with Watson podcast as we revisit some of our most impactful episodes from the inaugural season. Over the next two months, I'll share my journey of healing, highlighting the immense role my church, community, counseling, and faith have played in my transformation over the past four and a half years. Additionally, Crissy, a returning guest, offers her heartfelt insights and challenges as a caregiver for someone with PTSD, providing a beacon of hope and understanding for others in similar situations.

Together, Crissy and I dive deep into the power of support systems, the critical importance of safe spaces, and the necessity of grace and forgiveness in the healing process. We confront the tough realities of dealing with trauma and PTSD, including the unintended side effects like dishonesty. Our candid discussions aim to illustrate that with judgment-free support and a strong community, individuals can rise above their past behaviors and realize their true potential. Crissy's bravery in sharing her story, despite being shy and introverted, serves as a testament to the transformative power of honest communication and mutual understanding.

As we navigate the intense feelings of shame and the challenges of sharing personal stories publicly, our reflections emphasize the importance of fighting against hopelessness with faith and the belief that healing is achievable. The episodes also explore the need for reframing questions to foster safe environments for trust and vulnerability. As we prepare for exciting new content and format changes in September, this hiatus is an invitation to revisit these pivotal episodes and witness the unwavering faithfulness that has guided our journey. Join us as we offer hope, validation, and a reminder that you are seen, known, heard, loved, and valued.
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You ARE:
SEEN KNOWN HEARD LOVED VALUED

Speaker 1:

When it feels like you've lost your way and the road disappears in the haze, when your fading heart needs a northern star, I'll walk with you to the other side.

Speaker 2:

Hey everybody, and welcome to Wednesdays with Watson. It is July of 2024. And you are in for a little bit of a different experience If you are a regular listener to the Wednesdays with Watson podcast. Over the next two months, over July and August, we are going to put the podcast on hiatus. However, we are going to re-release some episodes from the first season that most of you probably have not heard, and so we're going to combine some of these episodes, many of which I left off on a cliffhanger, so back in the day, people had to wait two weeks to find out the rest of the story.

Speaker 2:

As you're listening to what we are going to share with you today, just keep in mind who you hear talking to you right now and how unbelievably faithful God has been, because, even when I look back to four and a half years ago, when I recorded these episodes, I am such a different person so much healing, so much hope, so much growth. And part of that has been because of this, which had become a bit of a passion project for me the Wednesdays with Watson podcast. But most of it is because of my church, my community and counseling, which, from the very beginning, became the tagline for this podcast, along with Jesus, who is the star of my story, and so, as you listen to these first set that we're going to drop today, we will be doing that all through July and August, and you will know, if you're a new listener, why all of these things matter to me. As for me, during July and August, I will be behind a computer getting my dissertation proposal ready. As some of you know, I am all but dissertation done with my doctorate degree in educational psychology, with a focus on trauma and community care. I'm looking forward to what that means for the podcast.

Speaker 2:

We have brand new content and a brand new format coming at you in September, and so, until then, though, especially for those of you that are new, enjoy these dropback episodes so that we can see how faithful God is. Hey, everybody, and welcome back to Wednesdays with Watson. By now, you know that I am your host, amy Watson, and we have called the inaugural season of the podcast PTSD Jesus and Me, definitely seeing the evolution of the podcast and even the evolution of some healing for me like stuff that I never even anticipated, and so, with that being said, the last few podcasts we have had a guest on, who is back with us today. Welcome back to the podcast, Chrissy.

Speaker 3:

Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for doing this. I know that this is a little bit outside your wheelhouse, so I do have a question for you, because I have fielded this question for about 10 days now and I'm tired of answering it. So I didn't put you on the spot because I know better than that, but one of the questions, since you know you have been on the podcast for the last I guess this is the third week and some people keep saying to me and different versions of this question is how did you get the most shy person on the face of the earth to do this? And so I tried to answer it. My guess is that you will be able to give them a better answer to how this is actually happening right now.

Speaker 3:

I am shy, I am introverted and I felt strongly that I should lend my voice because I I hope and pray that if there are others out there in my position as kind of a caregiver to someone with PTSD or or in other situations, that perhaps by speaking up I could help them, and I hope that people out there there'll be somebody who says, oh my gosh, me too I feel that way and that's helpful for how to be the person living with someone who is struggling with PTSD or any number of things For sure.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, and that's been my experience, and really some of the people that asked me the question asked it a little bit in tongue and cheek, because we all know that about you is that when it matters, you will speak up, and so one of the things that I think has surprised both of us is how hard this has been. I have spent the better part of my life pretty much putting myself out there. My story is fairly phenomenal. I say phenomenal, what I mean by that is phenomenal that I'm still breathing and that goes back to that sea. Jesus, my church, is the reason why that is still happening. But all that to say, we're we started doing this and then you and I started talking about it and I've been surprised about how hard it's been. Has that? Has that surprised you at all? Like this, this part of the experience, and talking about some of this?

Speaker 3:

It has been. I really feel like I. When we started talking, I thought, well, this isn't so bad, we're just chatting. But the after effect of talking about these, these hard times both dredging it up and dredging is the wrong word but revisiting those days has been surprisingly hard. But then there is this moment of feeling like, oh my, that's out there for the world. And I just realized that, beyond being shy and introverted, I'm a private person and so this has been hard. And yet I am just as passionate about making sure that this podcast gets out there, because I do think it's important. And so there has been some discomfort, I think, for both of us, for sure, but it's worth it if it helps someone.

Speaker 2:

Some of my yeah, I agreed with you there and I think that's the whole reason why I'm doing this. You know, I started this, this podcast, in the middle of the right. Now today is July of 2020. But whenever whoever is listening to this has started this podcast during the pandemic of 2020. And really I just needed a creative outlet. I didn't know what it was going to do, but I've always wanted to be a good steward of this pain.

Speaker 2:

I think what has been surprisingly difficult for me, and even where we left off on the last podcast, as you were explaining to me, we were talking about the reality of flashbacks and night terrors and some of the things that were necessary for me to make it to literally make it and not end up back in the hospital when I was thinking back at those times and I ended the last podcast by saying I want to say to you I'm sorry, but what I will say is thank you. And I was really shocked at how hard that moment was for me when I recorded the behind the mic video on our new YouTube channel. I actually got emotional talking about this. It hurt my heart to hear the depths that you were sent when I asked you that question Were you afraid that I was never going to make it? And so the Lord continues to do healing in this story, and we initially called these podcasts memory keepers. I think today we will start a series called a trench mates perspective, and and here's why I still want to continue to tell some of my story but I think that we have identified the importance of your voice in this process, as difficult as it has been.

Speaker 2:

As I mentioned, I continue to get emails from people that are sitting in your position, chrissy, where they or or they want, or people like me want to help people like you and their lives understand more, and so, because of that, I want to first, in this podcast, we're going to drop back into this conversation that you and I had about six weeks ago, and then there's going to seem to be a little bit of an awkward break where we're going to continue to talk about that same subject, but let's sneak back into where we left off last time and then we'll pick up from there, and the first words that I wanted to say were I'm sorry, but what I am going to say is thank you, and I know that we're not all rainbows and butterflies now, you still live with triggers and I'm so grateful to the Lord who just found a way to bolster you up, to be there during such a time as this or that, because I would not be here. And I always talk about my desire to be a good steward of the pain, and that's why we're sitting here doing this. We're going to play these few podcasts and we've got harder stuff to tell. Yeah, I want to encourage people out there that don't have a Chrissy though You're going to find it in a community Go to meetings.

Speaker 2:

You're going to find a community. There's hope. But I want people listening to this because this is an extraordinary story. This is an extraordinary story. Most people listening to this may be tempted to be discouraged and say but I don't have a Chrissy.

Speaker 3:

But neither did we. So I didn't have an Amy until the day I showed up for that Bible study and then showed up for Sunday school. I didn't want to go, I'm shy I didn't want to go, but I showed up and this is what the Lord did. And so today you may look and say I don't have that in my life. But you went, but I went, and you don't know what story the Lord is going to tell.

Speaker 3:

And this is a miracle. This story is a miracle and God can tell a billion more in a moment because he's able to. And so just because you don't have it today doesn't mean that God isn't going to provide that when you showed up in Clearwater, going to provide that. When you showed up in Clearwater after leaving John, you didn't have a job, a church or me, a family, and God showed up, Boy did he right?

Speaker 2:

Right Boy did he.

Speaker 3:

But for people who are listening and don't currently have those things, my logical brain immediately goes well, I don't have it, it'll never happen. That's not giving God a chance. Give him a chance. Trust him, start showing up. Don't be silent, even if you're the person who has suffered.

Speaker 2:

Because it's worse than the event.

Speaker 3:

Yes. Or the person who is living with someone who is hurting You're living with it. Get help too Huge. If you're a caregiver in some ways, if you are walking through this, you need a place to talk too, and a place that's safe to say. This is hard and I I don't know how to deal with this or I keep triggering these things how can I help? You need a safe place too, and that feels weird to say because because really, you're the one who's been through something.

Speaker 2:

Well, it's the whole. Put your oxygen mask on first.

Speaker 3:

Yes, I needed a safe place as well, and I had that in Mama Bootsy and in a small group of friends and in Dr. Pettit and in my faith, yeah, but it's imperative for both parties to make sure that you are taking care of yourself and that you have some safe places to share.

Speaker 2:

And this is really safe places to share. Huge, so huge. I had spent a lifetime of lying to protect myself, and so you had asked me a simple question like how much did you spend on that bike that you shouldn't have? And you just really, really wanted to know how much was that bike? You didn't care, you weren't in charge of my bank account, but I would lie to you about that Absolutely. And so how did you stick with me? You forgave me over and over and over and over, and it doesn't matter why I lied, because you've said two things to me over the years, and one of them is you often remind me, give yourself grace for those few good decisions you made to get a Chrissy Lothridge in your life.

Speaker 2:

And I got up one Wednesday night and went to that Bible study.

Speaker 2:

I got up one night, one day and went to that Bible study Cheryl's life group. I accepted the invitation to teach there. And that's not all me. That is that old footprints in the sand. Jesus picked me up and carried me and said you're going to go here, here and here. But you also had to forgive me a lot and so can you speak to. Yes, you need a safe place, but I had to have hurt your feelings and again you go back to the safe place.

Speaker 3:

And again you go back to the safe place, but I would lie to you about the price of a bike. The lying, of course, for me, being a truth speaker is the hardest part and will probably always be the hardest part for me.

Speaker 2:

Because we still struggle with this.

Speaker 3:

I don't bold-faced lie, but if I feel backed in a corner, Absolutely, and that took years for us to realize that if you get backed in a corner you'll lie. And so then I have to. I would frame the question in such a way that you were out of the corner.

Speaker 2:

I felt safe.

Speaker 3:

Well, and I felt safe to tell you the truth, so I would say something like man, if I wanted a bike, I'd spend a million dollars on it.

Speaker 2:

And then you'd tell me the truth You'd be like, well, it was only 1.4. Right.

Speaker 3:

Right. So then it became a win, right. So any way that I could reframe it so that you weren't looking like a bad guy, I knew I'd get the truth out of you. Well, I sure would eat a whole box of cereal instead of having the broccoli that I was supposed to have for dinner, and then you'd say, yeah, that's what I did too.

Speaker 2:

And so we still fight this because we still have an enemy who does not want this message out there, Out there and I everybody thinks he's the father of lies for a reason, and confusion and confusion, yeah, and lies, especially you will find it with PTSD and with domestic violence, especially.

Speaker 3:

You will find it with PTSD and with domestic violence especially because you've learned to survive on lies and with the childhood you had, you learned to survive on lies, and so to change that pattern overnight it's's not possible, barring a miracle. One of the things I want to make sure that that I say at this juncture because you, you asked a specific question is why did I stick with it? It's, it is 100%. I saw the person, I saw who you are, just like any person. If you're looking at them and seeing their sin and not seeing the person, then you're missing out. You've missed the whole point. I saw you.

Speaker 3:

I didn't see your lies, I saw you, I saw my friend, I saw this amazing, amazing, deep faith, wonderful outgoing person, deep faith, wonderful outgoing person. And so I wanted to dig in and get rid of the lies or any other problems, as we were facing different issues. If I stepped on a landmine, I wanted to find out what I had stepped on and why, and how can we get better, how do we find healing so that you could be the best version of you, because I knew from the day I met you you had a voice and that you could preach the gospel and that others might gain the Lord because of your story, but, more importantly, because of you. So, while you're telling your story on this podcast, the more important thing is you're not a superstar because you've suffered so much. You're a superstar because of who God made you, and don't miss that. I do miss that.

Speaker 2:

And.

Speaker 3:

I think that a lot of people want to. It is hard to not make a big deal about what you've been through. You were babysat by serial killers Right. Bum, bum, bum.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 3:

It's hard not to make that a headline, but who God made you is a big enough headline and it's enough.

Speaker 2:

It's enough, it's more than enough. Yeah, like, even if I didn't finish the book, which we all know I'm struggling to do, even if this was the last podcast, it's enough. So, yeah, that was, chrissy, the end of that original conversation that you and I had about six weeks ago, that I don't know about you, but we've edited this and listened to this so much. I'm not sure, actually, what will actually land on people's phones.

Speaker 2:

So we landed on, if I didn't do anything else with my life, if we didn't do another podcast, or I never wrote another word or whatever, that I am enough and that that enough conversation came out of a very organic conversation that was unexpected, quite frankly, about and you and I have been trying to find a way to explain this but the unintended, the negative I wanted to use the word consequence, but Side effects, yeah. So so some of the negative, because they really are negative side effects of PTSD, because we went off kind of on this organic conversation about one of the issues that you, as the person walking along closest with me, had to deal with was dishonesty and lying and and things of that nature, and so that really sat with both of us and we thought, huh boy, we need to. We need to spend some more time with this, wouldn't you agree?

Speaker 3:

Yes, and I think, re-listening to it six weeks later, I wanted to make sure that it was abundantly clear that your lying was not a character issue.

Speaker 3:

It wasn't who you are. It was a sin, and to differentiate, because there are times that you may meet someone or be in a relationship with someone who is toxic I'm air quoting or harmful or malicious or all of those things, and you might need to extricate yourself from the situation. This was not that situation, and I just want to make sure that people can understand that we're all sinners, so all of your friends at some point are going to hurt. You probably lie to you, and if you were to toss them out and say, well, you lied to me, I'm done, we're done, you're a liar, you're going to miss out to me, I'm done, we're done, you're a liar, you're going to miss out. You're going to miss out on everything that the Lord has for you in that friendship and that relationship, and so it really takes some discernment to know the difference between someone who is sinning versus someone who is a blank, whatever it is.

Speaker 2:

And there's an obvious reason like that kind of thing.

Speaker 2:

Some of these things and we're going to talk about them some of these things are out of character for that person and I think that we've talked before already about the importance of you had some people speaking into your life that you trusted and who would have told you to exit right and exit quickly in the event that it was bad for you.

Speaker 2:

But one of the questions I am getting a lot on social media is how do I help my person understand? And one of the things that I'd like you to say a little bit more, because I can actually visualize this in myself is you talked about a PTSD patient, particularly somebody with childhood trauma like I had as a wounded animal, and it's very difficult to do life alongside wounded people in general. But you've talked a little bit about that. How can? So? When I get these emails, I was like how can I help my mom or my sister, my aunt, my friend, understand that, understand me, me, talk to me a little bit about that, because that I heard you and I felt that as a PTSD patient when you talked about the wounded animal analogy.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I think you know. The more I think about it, the more you know. You really do realize that that is a lot of what's going on. The first problem with a wounded animal is you can't communicate, and similarly I was not communicating with you effectively to say I am safe, I am here. A lot of the hard work is figuring out how to communicate and how to let the person know this is a safe place.

Speaker 2:

And I will say so. We're going to start talking about page turners, and we've got a lot of pages to turn in this story that only the Lord can tell. Just like everybody else's story out there, my story is no more phenomenal or important than yours, and I say it all the time do not compare the stories, but you and I have lots of pages to turn on on in this story, and one of them is this idea of doing life with the person and really what you're signing up for when you do that, because there are behaviors that exhibit themselves, and this dishonesty thing for me was one of them. And when I felt so, you, you, we laughed, and I can't remember whether this actual audio actually made it onto the podcast or not at this point, but we were laughing because you're like well, it only took us 185 years to figure out that if I backed you in a corner, it only took us that long to figure that out, and so that's what I want people listening to.

Speaker 2:

This is like as somebody walking alongside with somebody who has a negative side effect, like feeling like I'm backed in a corner. I need to protect myself, so I'm going to lie about the price of a bike. How can you help that person? Because I can tell you from my standpoint, when I stopped feeling judged by you whether or not you were judging me or not but when I stopped feeling judged when you came alongside and I can't remember whether you actually said it or I just knew it like this isn't who you are lying about the price of that bike. So what's really going on? Kind of like that old version of what really happened to you when I stopped feeling judged and you came along. I'm a sinner too, or I lie too, or I do this. To that too, then, and only then could I go. This is a problem.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, and I think that that is what needs to happen in anyone's situation is find those key elements. What is the root of the issue? I knew for you one of them early on. I did figure out was you felt like if I said that's a lie, that I was saying you are a liar and it was a character attack, and so I would immediately say I am not attacking your character, I don't believe this is who you are, but this is not truthful. The judging came later, where I could specifically address hey, I'm not trying to judge you, I would do the same thing or I would do something similar in your situation too. But let's talk about what the truth is, or however you word it. But the key is to find out what is the deeper thing that is really haunting the person. This really goes for everybody In any situation. If somebody is behaving out of sorts, if you've punched someone's buttons, stepped on a landmine, in general there's a reason, and if you can figure out what that is, then you both can address it and hopefully move forward.

Speaker 2:

Right, yeah, and I think that. So again, we're talking about the unintended side effects of PTSD, and one of them, for me, was slash is you know, this desire to protect myself by way of not telling the truth when I didn't feel safe, and so. But I want to continue to talk about some of those and really bleed that into a little bit of what happened after. Right, so I had gone back to work and was not doing well. That ministry that is, that church and school, about 45 days out, said, hey, you know what? You're not, okay, go home. And they honored my contract and I went home and continued to.

Speaker 2:

We continued to really struggle with some of those night terrors and things that we talked about, but I knew that I needed to. I had to have a job and in the classroom, as much as I loved, it was not going to be that job for me because of some of the stuff that I was going through. And really the Lord just extricated me from that situation because, quite frankly, that classroom, those kids, that ministry, had become an idol for me and it had become a deterrent for me to not address some of these things that we're talking about, and one of them being the dishonesty. The other one is performance. Ban the dishonesty, the other one is performance, and I had spent my whole life performing my way out of the pain, and so one of the things that we can weave into every one of these unintended side effects of PTSD is we can tie it back to I had no ability to understand my value. I had no ability to understand my value. About 99.9% of the people that just heard that sentence also has no ability to understand their value.

Speaker 2:

And I go back, chrissy, to Stacy and her birthday verse, and when I met her in the psych ward and the verses said you are more valuable than many sparrow and how I. Just at that point in my life, and even most days at this point in my life, I didn't get that, but I knew that after I healed a little bit. So I spent that summer pretty much healing, and we had already talked about what would be next. I knew that the classroom wasn't going to be the place for me, and so I had to find a job. We had been talking about starting a business before I moved to Clearwater and taught. I had done this exact same business for about 12 years, and so after that summer we started our business Watermark Management Group. And do you remember, chrissy, how we named the watermark? You remember how much fun that was.

Speaker 3:

Yes, yes, we didn't know what we were going to name it and we just used an iPod and hit shuffle.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So we hit shuffle and we said the first song that speaks to us. That's what we're going to name the business. We were starting, a business where there was all kinds of opportunities for redemption, based on how I had spent 12 years of my life and my career in that domestic violence marriage, and so starting this business really was an opportunity to redeem those years. But it also fed one of these unintended consequences slash side effects of PTSD which I was using as an analgesic. I was using it to cope with the pain, because even the handfuls of medications still weren't getting that done for me, and so this was an opportunity to perform. But we were riding down the road and the song came on by a group called Watermark, and these are the lyrics that made us name our business Watermark Management Group.

Speaker 2:

Because of who you are and who I am, in you you make all things pure. Because of who you are and who I am, in you, you make all things true. You make all things new. And of course, everybody knows how much I love that verse Joel 2.25, where the Bible says that I will restore the years that the locusts have stolen from you. And so, chrissy, I want to thank you for talking today and and we're going to really make this a springboard off into these unintended side effects of PTSD, because I continue to get messages from loved ones and so we will pick up in a couple weeks continuing to talk about some behaviors that some of you may be seeing in the people that you love, and then this Trenchmates perspective.

Speaker 1:

As the years go by and the days get lost in time. Wherever you go, you will always know I'll walk with you to the other side.

Speaker 2:

Hey everybody, welcome back to Wednesdays with Watson. I'll walk with you to the other side season of the podcast, ptsd Jesus and Me. And today we are mid-season and that is so hard to believe. I am so grateful for those of you who have spent time with me on these podcasts, who have messaged me, and even for those of you who have shared it and helped get the podcast out there. Sincere gratitude to you. But we are mid-season and, guys, we talked about the podcast evolving at the beginning and certainly it is doing that. We are learning, we are growing. One thing I can tell you is that today's podcast is for 100% of the population of planet Earth, and so I want you to kind of sit back and drop into this beginning of this conversation. These two words are on my website and they are on my website and they are two words that are so important to me and I want them to be important to you because they are true. This is the first podcast of the you Matter series. Because you do matter, let's go, guys.

Speaker 2:

2 am that is the magic time for me. My body seems too light to wake me up at that time and any horrible thing that can happen or that I can remember. I guarantee you, if I look at the clock, it's 2 am and it was about 2 am right before or, excuse me, about two hours after the last podcast record actually dropped, and I woke up with full-on flashbacks and I, as very common with flash flashbacks, don't remember what they were. But I was also so riddled with shame I literally put my head in my hands and I thought to myself what have I done? I just basically laid my soul bare out there for the world to hear. The voices of shame were shouting and a lot of them sounded like my voice and they were telling me Amy, you are your mistakes, you are that unfortunate, you are that person with those unfortunate, negative, attention seeking behaviors that come with PTSD. Shame was telling me that night, in the middle of the night that's who you are, and you just told the whole world that you have an attention seeking behavior and you plan to continue. So I just kind of laid there for a few minutes and I wondered wow, can I unpublish this podcast? I looked at the stats and only one person had listened to it, but I didn't actually even know how to unpublish it, because I don't publish it my, my, my producer does. And so I was like, well, um, okay, well, I can't unpublish it, so maybe I should try to start stop getting my heart from pounding Like it's racing somewhere really quickly, cause it was just pounding.

Speaker 2:

From the flashback and from this sense of shame that I heard and that I felt, I laid there and I thought what, seriously, what have I done? What have I done? And also I kept hearing various mostly well-meaning voices from my childhood, their voice actually saying you should be ashamed of yourself, and I was. I am indeed ashamed, but I also know that that's the game and we can't lose that game, and so I want to fight. Here's a spoiler alert, by the way Jesus wins in the end. Jesus wins in the end.

Speaker 2:

I knew when I started the podcast that I have dubbed my pandemic podcast, that PTSD was an important topic. Jesus is so important to the story as it's his, not mine, I know that and you know that, and I say that, hopefully, on everyone so important that I put his name in the title. But this middle of the night flashback was as bad as I had really had in a long, long time, you know, as Chrissy and I sat and chatted for hours in that closet. It was fun, it was a blast, we laughed and had lots of good memories and it was cool to reflect on the faithfulness of God. But we did that for hours and it stirred up all kinds of emotions. So I got up that night after the podcast had been up for about two and a half hours at that point and jumped in the shower. The cold water in the middle of the night woke me up a little bit and kind of reset me to some degree.

Speaker 2:

No-transcript on the last podcast, but as I sat there, the sounds of the night reminded me who was actually in control. And then I just remember the words of this song that I love so much. If you gave your life for them, so will I. If creation seeks to praise you, so will I. And so if you hear my voice right now, you are them to me. I will lay down on this and we will keep fighting just for one of you.

Speaker 2:

So now it's like 3.30 in the morning. I walked back into my house and finally just relented and took some medicine and finally fell back asleep. But those voices of shame were loud. Back asleep, but those voices of shame were loud. They were telling me that I was worthless. They were telling me to stop doing this podcast, to stop writing. They were telling me to stop telling the world that you don't have to live in shame and guilt. I hoped a few more hours of sleep would reset me. Sometimes that happens when you fall back asleep Because I plan to leave the podcast up, because I knew it to be obedient.

Speaker 2:

But I also understand that I'm going to be working through this shame thing and it's here to stay. It wants to take my value. It wants to take yours too. So what we aren't going to do is quit, because you matter and I matter, and so we're going to continue to stay with this. We're going to continue to evolve. We're going to continue to heal, because I started this podcast to give people hope Hope that you can heal from unspeakable trauma. And yeah, mainly this season is for PTSD patients, for people who love them, for people who minister to them. But this very podcast, as I said in the intro, is for 100% of the population. I have started, as I just jokingly said, I've started calling this my pandemic podcast. Apparently, it's a pretty popular thing, as you can't even buy a mic on Amazon right now, but anyway, I started this podcast at a time you know who knows where we are in this pandemic the beginning, middle end but I started it and right now, on this day that I'm recording it is at a time when hope seems to be at an all-time low.

Speaker 2:

I firmly believe that hope is the bond that we all seek for the pain, but we always seek it in other things. And then hopelessness, when left unchecked, is tragic and leads to all of these attention-seeking behaviors that we're going to talk about and a whole lot other things. The Bible says that hope deferred makes the heart sick. It's so true. It's so true for all of us. I know that because I get messages from people all the time now who have questions and are seeking help, and I'm way in over my head because I know that I'm only qualified to tell you my story and things that work for me. But the message is the same from everyone who messages or emails they are running low on hope.

Speaker 2:

2020 has drained us of our earthly hope Every single person on this planet and dimmed our light, and so everyone is feeling a little needy. In some ways. That isn't a bad thing. Needs drive us to solutions. I think it's the solutions that we need to watch, and we will definitely be talking about that.

Speaker 2:

So, because this podcast is for 100% of the population, here's what I want to make sure that I want to continue to repeat over and over in this podcast is we all want to be seen, we all want to be known, we all want to be loved, we all want to be heard, we all want to be valued. And here's the great news, guys, we are all of those things. I am no different and as a result of even sitting behind this microphone and the feedback that I get from it makes me feel those things, all those things that I just mentioned Seen, known, loved, heard and valued. But as much as I love my people, I have learned the hard way that my eternal hope and value doesn't come from people but from God, and so I want to bring shame back into the conversation, because shame can't take it, because shame didn't give me my value. God gave me my value.

Speaker 2:

Did you guys know that it only took 25 verses in the Bible? 25 verses in the Bible. So Genesis 1 26 addresses our value. Where we, where God says that we are made in his image, 25 verses into the Bible, value gets addressed. We are made in his image, which is so amazing and so unable to be comprehended. Psalm 139 describes how precious we are in his sight and that we are formed in his image again. But it only takes six verses for the psalmist to acknowledge that.

Speaker 2:

Whoa, this idea of value is way, way in over my head Depends on which translation you're reading. Way in over my head Depends on which translation you're reading, but it is everything from. You know, it's too lofty for me to understand, it's too much for me to understand. But Genesis 1 26 does tell us that we are made in that image, equally loved by him, with a special purpose, with special giftings and, yeah, with special pain, special, unique pain. That word unique is there on purpose to remind you not to compare your pain with mine or anyone else's In my sphere of influence.

Speaker 2:

I hear a lot of horror stories, especially as it pertains to domestic violence, and even I'm tempted to compare my stories. Don't do it, guys. It's a dark road and it just makes shame grow, grow, grow, grow. Shame grows in the dark and that's a dark road. I wasn't given any of the things that you need to walk your road and you weren't given the things to walk mine, and that's why we don't compare. But we can help each other and that is the point.

Speaker 2:

Community it's one of the three C's Because, besides me wanting you to know the peace that only comes with knowing with Jesus, my biggest wish for you is that you get connected with a community. Please go get connected with a community, I beg you. Chrissy is one of my community Ride or Die members and we, as I mentioned, we had a blast recording those three podcasts. Those conversations are simply too much to recap, and so I would certainly encourage you to go back, but it was really fun and interesting and painful and all kinds of weird emotions. That experience of her unjumbling some of my PTSD memories was all of those things I already mentioned several times now the shame that I felt after hitting the publish button and by that I mean my producer hit the publish button, but that podcast was also fraught with other issues. We had so many audio issues that everything that you can imagine happened. So I knew that it wasn't an award-winning audio experience. But the last part of that conversation took that unexpected turn and the content was too anointed for me to reproduce and so we left it. And I'm telling you guys I still regret it this very moment I'm fighting y'all. I'm fighting.

Speaker 2:

I've been working through this shame because on that podcast we began to talk about what you will hear me refer to a lot in the next several podcasts as attention-seeking behaviors, and in that particular podcast, chrissy and I had some hard conversation about one of my own attention-seeking behaviors which I had battled most of my life, and especially in the early days of my friendship with her, by way of dishonesty. Certainly I have and continue to work through some of these things in counseling and obviously I understand why I use dishonesty to deflect, to ensure safety, especially in the middle of my domestic violence, marriage, or because I was just needing to feel seen, known, loved, heard, valued. I don't know that even this time last year I would have had the emotional health to do what we did by hitting publish on that podcast or even understanding this idea of attention-seeking behaviors and why we have them. And so I often think that Psalm 139.6 was written just for me, because that whole concept of value is way too lofty for me to understand. My real enemy and your real enemy, the father of lies, confusion and chaos likes to make us all forget our value, and you're not going to be any different from me, whether you have PTSD or not.

Speaker 2:

When we forget our value, we begin to exhibit attention seeking behaviors, which often turns into the shame that I keep talking about. When we forget our Genesis 126 status, made in the image of God, Attention seeking behavior has the opportunity to abound and I want you to remember that. That community that I keep talking to you about here's something that you really need to do. You need to make sure that that community also looks like accountability. You need to make sure you have some people in your community that will call you out and that will call you higher and that will make you mad to the point that you will evaluate. So make sure your community, some people in your community, looks like accountability. As I've mentioned three times now, this podcast is for 100% of the population, because even if you don't have PTSD, you have attention seeking behaviors. That just makes you human.

Speaker 2:

Now, shame drives some of this, for sure, but then it's the hamster wheel where shame becomes comes from a variety of attention seeking behaviors and it just becomes normal to feel shameful all the time. What also becomes the norm is our is is our complete inability to take care of ourselves and all the things that we do with things that we value. When we forget our image bearer status, we really have this inability to remember that we are seen, known, loved, heard and valued. I know the devil loves dark corners. He likes to live, he likes us to live in this guilt and shame and, most of all, he is a master salesman. He convinces us of needs that we don't have and then he gives us ill-fated solutions to needs that we actually do have. These are the kinds of things that nobody talks about, but they're common to every single one of us.

Speaker 2:

Most of us just go to sleep within our minds at night, and I've decided to tell the world hit record and have it published and then fight the shame and the inability to remember my value after it. But I am doing that because I'm tired, guys, so tired of watching. I'm tired of doing this and I'm tired of watching it, of living in guilt and shame, because it does not have to be that way at all. I am going to continue to keep locking myself in this closet and I'm going to keep doing this because he gave his life for you. The least I can do is share authentically with you, even when it brings the opportunity for my own shame.

Speaker 2:

I spent so many years frustrated and so loathing about this idea of attention-seeking behaviors, and never really more so than when I was just 14 years old. When I was 14 years old, I had been living with foster parents for about 18 months and on June 6, 1987, those foster parents who had taken care of me when the state removed me from the state of Florida but from my mom. They took care of me for 18 months, but they had their own ministry and their own family, were good people and because of some of these attention-seeking behaviors, I needed more help than they could give me. And so, june 6, 1987, I found my 14-year-old self standing underneath a sign that said Faith Children's Home. It was just another abandonment in my mind. At that point it was a day that still makes my heart beat fast and my voice tremble, because, even though those were the best years of my life, that was a hard day.

Speaker 2:

So my foster parents left and it was lunchtime and I made my way into the main building where all the children were housed and it was because it was lunchtime, as I mentioned. Everybody was there. Huge, these two huge rooms with these big, long wooden tables where everybody sat, and two big rooms, one of them where everyone ate, and then a big kitchen, obviously an industrial-sized kitchen, because you know, there were a lot of kids to feed and so they were eating shrimp or something that was donated from Taco Bell, and that's a whole other story for another day. All I know is I didn't want any Taco Bell, and that's a whole other story for another day. All I know is I didn't want any Taco Bell shrimp, and so I found a place to hide in between this industrial-sized refrigerator and this cabinet and there was a little red chair in there, almost as if it were inviting me to sit there so that the new kid could hide. And so I did.

Speaker 2:

I kind of sneaked back there a little bit and it was dark and I could hear all the goings on of of what was happening, and I certainly didn't understand how I could hear the laughter of children, and but I did. I heard all of those things, and then so I'm just kind of processing all of this in this little dark space that might have been a foot long, where I could just barely kind of shimmy myself in there. I was not who I am today, outgoing gregarious, will take over a room. I was very shy, very wounded and really didn't want anybody to see me, so pretty much the complete opposite of what I am today. And so when this head popped in my little oasis, there I was, my eyes probably were the size of saucers and it was the whitest hair I had ever seen in my life, with a Southern accent that I couldn't reproduce if I tried this. She said, well, hello. And I just stared at her. I didn't even answer her back and she had the, the, as I mentioned, the most southern accent of anybody I've ever heard in my life. She hailed from Maggie Valley, north Carolina. She said to me has anybody told you today again, just staring at her, but had been taught enough manners to go, ma'am, she has anybody told you today that they love you? I'm quiet here for a second because I remember in that moment my foster parents certainly had told me they love me, but there was something different about this. So I just looked up and said no, ma'am. She said, well, I love you. I'm Mom McGowan.

Speaker 2:

That day, even though it wasn't overnight, created an incredible bond between Mom McGowan and me. She and Dad had started the children's home that day, that day where she just gave me what I just wanted some attention. She saw me, she loved, she saw me, she heard me, she valued me, she knew I was there, I felt known, I follow all those things I keep talking about, and so it created a bond that I had not known up until that point, but it also created a bit of a monster. A couple weeks ago I gave an example on substance abuse where one is too many and 10,000 is not enough, and so in some ways, when I got attention from Mama Gowan, it was like that I sought to fill all of those pains and that abandonment and all that stuff that I had gotten to at 14 years old seven abusers, you know, abandoned by my mom, old seven abusers, you know, abandoned by my mom, really every kind of abuse that you can think.

Speaker 2:

I was seeking to fill those empty spaces with her, and it didn't matter how much attention she gave me. I wanted more. My lies to her were kind of like they were to Chrissy. They were just lies that would get me attention, lies that would physically put me in her proximity so that I could be around her. But when I would exhibit those attention-seeking behaviors and in that case a lie and I'd lay in bed at night and our room at the children's home had six twin beds and there were sort of five other people in the room with me, and so we learned to cry silently and I would lay there at night feeling guilty about about lying because I and I was so convinced that I was worthless, because I needed her attention and that frustrated me so much that I needed that attention. I didn't understand that I simply had unmet needs that I was doing whatever I could do to meet them Just a human condition, not necessarily just a PTSD one.

Speaker 2:

I don't know how many of you at night put your heads down and feel some of this emptiness that I'm describing or feel guilty about whatever form of attention-seeking behavior you had that day, but I know that I have spent so many years self-loathing and not living to my potential because I simply could not understand this need for attention from other people. Why couldn't God be enough? Perhaps I was just too broken and I really did believe that Until recently. Recent years, my tribe and my community have locked arms with me and ushered me to him through simply living their lives and making sure I was at least attempting to live mine, making me feel all those things that I am valued, loved, seen, known, heard. And so those were nights, as a young Amy, that I didn't understand this need for attention, and so this attention-seeking behavior came out in ways to put me near her. But it didn't matter how much attention she gave me, because I didn't understand my value. What mattered was the attention that she did give me. So the amount of attention didn't matter, but what mattered was the attention she did give me drove me to the cross and to Jesus as the only person who can even sort of make this pain bearable.

Speaker 2:

And we would have these great lean-in conversations, and I love some lean-in conversations. I still have them with Mama Gallen and we still have that bond. I do love a lean-in conversation and that is why I love community so much as Chrissy and I were unpacking a little more of these side effects or consequences of post traumatic stress disorder depends on which one of us you ask. I say consequence, she says side effects. We realize that some of them are certainly pronounced in people with trauma. But, as I've mentioned, I think four times now, if everyone were being 100% honest, we all have times, places and spaces where we just need, and because we're resourceful human beings, we will do what we have to do to fill those needs, like I did at the children's home, even as worthless as it made me feel those nights in that twin bed.

Speaker 2:

Think about it, though. From a very early age we are built this way. This is evidence like if you watch a baby throw their bottle on the floor, only for you to pick it up and hand it back to them. That will go on for as many times as you will pick the bottle up and hand it to the baby. On the part of the baby, the baby just wants to be seen, known, heard, loved and valued. Same with us we're just grown-up babies throwing a bottle on the floor, but when the parents actually pick the child up and hug them and love them, now they feel valued. The need is met. I don't need you to pick the bottle up off the floor for me.

Speaker 2:

So, as Chrissy and I were talking about this and we have these lean-in conversations all the time, like I used to have with Mom McGowan as we were talking about this, she said something that stopped me in my tracks. She was actually talking at that point about her own trauma, some of which she has agreed to share in due time. But I was literally leaning into that conversation. But then she said something that made me sit back in my chair and this is what it was. She said what if I am too broken to fix? What if your listeners feel too broken to fix? So I kind of just stared at her and got up and left to be honest with you, because I knew that she was trying to spur my creativity. But I also knew that she wanted an answer from me, somebody that she trusts as her own ride or die community.

Speaker 2:

So I thought as I walked back over to my house, because Chrissy and I are neighbors, man, I started this podcast for Susie Smith and Mary Wright and now one of my best friends in the whole world, with tear-filled eyes, has just asked me if she was too broken to fix. So I walked into my door and I was like, yeah, I know that feeling. I remembered it from that twin bed at the children's home where I thought it was worthless because I craved Mama Gallen's attention. I remembered it from the shame I felt early in the years of my PTSD diagnosis as I continued to pile attention-seeking behavior on top of attention-seeking behavior. We're going to talk about quite a few of those, by the way.

Speaker 2:

I remember feeling too broken to fix. I remember wishing I were too broken to fix because that meant I could live my life with plenty of excuse and zero purpose. But the reality is as hard as I try, I know that I love a God who redeems the years that the locusts have stolen. I've stopped asking why he stole the years and I look forward to great anticipation to watch him continue to grow and restore the years and purpose. And if you hear my voice right now, you are my purpose. If you hear my voice right now, you are my purpose.

Speaker 2:

This being too broken to fix concept, coupled with the unintended side effects of PTSD or negative consequences or whatever we're calling it, or just being human in general, can be lethal, and I knew that. And I knew that, like I said, while she was trying to spur on my creativity, she just wanted an answer to my question. So, yeah, I left her house, but it sent me directly to scripture because I wanted to be able to tell you, to tell her, hey, I wanted to be able to tell myself that I'm not too broken to fix because, remember, I'm still feeling shame because I've told the world about some of my shame or some of my behaviors that made me feel shameful. I remembered the story in the Bible of the lady who was healed simply because she touched the hem of Jesus's robe, so I went searching for that story, and I found it in Mark, chapter 5.

Speaker 2:

She was a lady with a bleeding disorder, and the Bible tells us that she had been healing, seeking healing from this order for about 12 years. It is thought that she spent all of her money and all of her resources trying to fix this bleeding disorder. That is was probably gynecological in nature, and so, as we know, in that region, especially during that time, women basically were to see, be seen and not heard none of the things that we're talking about today. It is thought that her bleeding disorder, as I mentioned, was gynecological in nature, and so that would have put her even more of an outcast, bringing more opportunity for here's that word again shame. I bet she also felt broken. I bet she didn't feel seen, known, loved, heard or valued.

Speaker 2:

Here's the thing that stopped me in my tracks, though, because she made a decision one day to get up, leave her house and find Jesus, because she heard he was going to be in town. Now, he wasn't coming in town to hang out, he was en route to another miracle. She just knew he was passing through. I bet if I could have asked, she probably would have phrased her question just like Chrissy did. She had been seeking a solution for her brokenness for 12 years. Am I too broken to fix?

Speaker 2:

But what was so amazing to me, and I want it to be to you too, is that in a last-ditch effort, she made a decision to go looking for Jesus. Think about that for a minute. Think about what would happen if, in your darkest days whether they're PTSD days or human days you got up and went looking for Jesus. The Bible says that when she touched the hem of his garment, jesus felt the power go out of him. He said who touched me? And when she answered, it was me. He said to her your faith has made you whole.

Speaker 2:

I was sitting on my porch the next morning and I was reading the passage again. The way Jesus chose to answer that question your faith has made you whole infers that she was broken, doesn't it? Certainly, we are all broken. It is the human condition and, as I mentioned, ptsd only pronounces that. I think about this decision, lady's decision to go find Jesus, and how that decision changed everything for her. I could relate to that too, because I was reminded of those early decisions to seek community, to go to church. I wish I could say that I sought Jesus the way that lady did in her brokenness, but because I made a few decisions to seek community, jesus came with them.

Speaker 2:

So as we move on with the second half of the season, I want to say that I say to Chrissy and I say to any of you asking the different form of her question no, you're not too broken to fix, and the best way I can see getting air quote fixed is to go looking for community and value. If you lay your head down at night and think about the things that you did that day to garner attention of another, you need to feel very normal, especially right now in the middle of a pandemic, but also know that you don't have to feel that way. Your faith can make you whole. Our mission here is not done. I am not quitting. I'm going to keep telling you shameful behaviors. I have spent this entire podcast setting up. The rest of the season.

Speaker 2:

The next few podcasts will continue to feature consequences of post-traumatic stress disorder as they exhibit themselves in all sorts of attention-seeking behaviors. Because, as Maya Angelou said, when you know better, you do better, and knowledge puts shame in its most famous representative and the bright light of revelation. So I want y'all to come with me, because we're going to do this thing together. Those of you who feel like I do right now, like your shame defines you and you can't remember your value, I want you to stay with me, because we are going to be straight up, real and raw. We're going to be transparent. We're going to be true. We can have PTSD, we can love people with PTSD, we can minister to people with PTSD, we can be human. We can need attention. We can minister to people with PTSD. We can be human, we can need attention, we can need hope, but none of that has to rule us. So we're going to call it out of the corner.

Speaker 2:

So shame has been defined as this. I am a mistake, not I made a mistake. So we are going to call shame out of the corner. We're going to legit call it out of the corner. We're going to shine light on it and, like I said, we're going to be real, we're going to be raw, we're going to be transparent, we're going to be truthful. And so, over these next two weeks, I'm going to be praying for everyone who hears this to know that shame is not who you are. Shame is not who you are. You, my friend, are far from a mistake, and shame has no game with you or with me, and definitely has no game with the one who made you. You matter. It's been on my website since I opened it. You matter. Do not forget that. Keep fighting, keep praying, keep remembering you're made in the image of God. Don't feel weird when you can't understand that concept. You can borrow my faith right now if you don't have any of your own Great song by Bebo Norman.

Speaker 2:

I am looking forward to being back with you guys in two weeks, where we will dive deep back into these attention seeking behaviors. Chrissy will be back, so you don't have to hear two versions of stories. Until then, I want you to live loved. I want you to live chosen. I want you to live courageous. More than anything, I want you to remember you are seen, you are known. I want you to remember you are seen, you are known, you are heard, you are loved and, most of all, you are valued. You are a precious child of the Most High God. Hey guys, it's me again and we are still in 2024.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for listening to these throwback episodes of the Wednesdays with Watson podcast. We would love it. If you subscribe to the podcast, you can do that right there in your app, wherever you are. You can follow as a checkmark at the top right hand corner of podcast, of Apple podcasts, and then just write in other apps. You can just follow or subscribe and help the show grow.

Speaker 2:

As we go into September, we will be having new content, as I mentioned at the beginning of the show, and a new format as well, as I get closer to finishing my doctorate degree. One more thing by means of housekeeping, if you are so inclined. The Patreon link is in the show notes, and so if you want to support what we're doing here, which is to help people who cannot afford counseling, please just click on that link and you can support us for as low as $5, among as many of my listeners do. And so until two weeks from now, when we bring you some more drop back episodes I don't want to say drop back there, amy, when we bring you some more throwback episodes. I want you to remember what I always say, and I never leave a microphone without it you are seen, you are known, you are heard, you are loved and you are so, so valued. And ask yourself today, can you answer the question in the affirmative, just like I can?

Speaker 1:

Has he been faithful for all of your life. When your weary soul needs a hand to hold, I'll walk with you to the other side. Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh. Never gonna let you down, never gonna let you down, never gonna let you down, never gonna let you down, never gonna let you down. Oh, as the years go by and the days get lost in time, Wherever you go, you will always know I'll walk with you To the other side. I'll walk with you to the other side.

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Amy Watson

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